Started down the Tropheus hole

fishguy1978

Legendary Member
Very thankful to @sir_keith who started me on this new challenge. The gift of 13 Tropheus sp. 'black' Bemba 'Flame' has definitely changed the dynamics of the 115g.
They are squabbling over space behind the dark tower. The two males are working out dominance too. I have two pumps and a large powerhead to make the focus more on swimming than fighting.
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fishguy1978

Legendary Member
I currently am running a 1350gph DC pump, a ~500gph pump and a large power head. All three outlets are pointed in different directions to create irregular currents. I’m considering either a larger DC pump 1800-2600gph or a controllable wave make. The tank is 115g (50in x 24in x 22in).
Question, since Tropheus inhabit the wave surf zone where the is strong constantly changing water movement, how much flow is to much?
 

sir_keith

Legendary Member
Contributing Member Level III
Although Tropheus inhabit rocky shorelines in relatively shallow water (~15-70 feet), they do not live in the surge zone, where goby cichlids such as Eretmodus and Spathodus are found. As such, although there is ample water movement in their natural habitat, it is not pronounced; certainly not enough to interfere with diving (and fish collection).

That said, I think you have plenty of water movement in your tank already. You do not want to have so much movement that the Tropheus have to fight the current constantly. There are lots of places in the intermediate rocky biotope where Tropheus and Ophthalmotiapia coexist, and in those areas the water movement is best described as gentle.

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I would like to see another rock-defined area on the right side of the tank that the second co-dominant male can defend.
 

DMD123

Administrator
Staff member
Contributing Member Level III
@fishguy1978, Just a dumb question, since you have a high PH normally, do you need to do anything else to the water? Add Buffer or salts? That was one aspect I hated with the shellies I tried for a bit. The cost of the chemicals needed to keep them happy was kind of the main thing that kept me from continuing on with them.
 

fishguy1978

Legendary Member
@fishguy1978, Just a dumb question, since you have a high PH normally, do you need to do anything else to the water? Add Buffer or salts? That was one aspect I hated with the shellies I tried for a bit. The cost of the chemicals needed to keep them happy was kind of the main thing that kept me from continuing on with them.
I have been adding Seachem’s Tanganyika buffer but I am weaning ish the tanks off as I do water changes. I will have to do some water tests in a month or so and see how it goes.
The Shellie’s and the Sumbu dwarves have aragonite and the Tropheus have inert sand.
 

sir_keith

Legendary Member
Contributing Member Level III
@fishguy1978 ...do you need to do anything else to the water? Add Buffer or salts? That was one aspect I hated with the shellies I tried for a bit. The cost of the chemicals needed to keep them happy was kind of the main thing that kept me from continuing on with them...
It works out to about 8 cents per gallon in chemicals, which over the course of a year is a whole lot cheaper than fish food...
 

sir_keith

Legendary Member
Contributing Member Level III
Changed up the scape to see if the males will redistribute. I’m not sure if they will as the back corner seems to be the prime location.
I’m open to ideas though.
Clearly they are more comfortable in the left side of the tank, which leads me to believe that they might be having a hard time adjusting to such an open tank, light-wise, and are favouring that corner because it provides some 'shade.' As you saw, they were in a tank with a black background on the lower level of one of my racks, in a dark corner of my fish room. I assume they'll eventually become accustomed to the new arrangement, but you could try putting something over the back of the tank just to try this idea out, assuming that doesn't offend your sense of aesthetics. It's my impression that Tanganyikans in general are more skittish than Neotropicals in captivity, and I have never kept them in see-through tanks.
 

fishguy1978

Legendary Member
Clearly they are more comfortable in the left side of the tank, which leads me to believe that they might be having a hard time adjusting to such an open tank, light-wise, and are favouring that corner because it provides some 'shade.' As you saw, they were in a tank with a black background on the lower level of one of my racks, in a dark corner of my fish room. I assume they'll eventually become accustomed to the new arrangement, but you could try putting something over the back of the tank just to try this idea out, assuming that doesn't offend your sense of aesthetics. It's my impression that Tanganyikans in general are more skittish than Neotropicals in captivity, and I have never kept them in see-through tanks.
Black trash bags make great, cheap instant backgrounds :cool:21FBDD0B-A67D-4A01-AD8B-70C6D979C336.jpeg
 

fishguy1978

Legendary Member
A couple of long time members on MFK who have experience with tropheus are telling me I’m going to induce bloat by messing with the tank.
I don’t discount stress causing issues but am I risking bloat by rescaping the tank?
 

sir_keith

Legendary Member
Contributing Member Level III
A couple of long time members on MFK who have experience with tropheus are telling me I’m going to induce bloat by messing with the tank.
I don’t discount stress causing issues but am I risking bloat by rescaping the tank?
No. Their fishes must have been seriously compromised by other issues if moving a rock caused bloat. There is a great deal of mythology online about Tropheus, and most of it is nonsense.
 

fishguy1978

Legendary Member
@sir_keith sent me a link to an article on tropheus aggression. Interesting idea from the article regarding decorations in the tank. Tanks with more decorations had higher levels of aggression as males try to stake a claim.
 

sir_keith

Legendary Member
Contributing Member Level III
Yes. In the wild both male and female Tropheus establish territories that are primarily feeding grounds where they graze on algae. Dominant males have the largest territories, with abundant algae, and their breeding strategy is to entice a receptive female into that territory, where she will graze ad libitum for several weeks until she is full of eggs, and receptive to spawning. After spawning, she leaves his territory to incubate the embryos on her own for ~4 weeks, often in the company of other brooding females, before releasing a small number of well-developed fry, all of which are the progeny of that single male. This is unusual amongst Tanganyikan mouthbrooders, most of whom incubate multipaternal broods.

There is no way to recapitulate these behaviours in captivity, because even our largest tanks are don't provide enough space. And unlike Mbuna, Tropheus are basically open-water fishes that don't require rock caves for shelter. Given these facts, my Tropheus tanks have minimal rock work, just enough to (i) provide shelter for any adults that might be the targets of undue aggression, and (ii) give fry and juveniles places to hide whilst growing to sizes (~1") large enough to join the main colony. Those tanks tend to look like this; there isn't a great deal to fight over-


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sir_keith

Legendary Member
Contributing Member Level III
Several things make me nervous about these flakes - (i) the first, and therefore most abundant, ingredient is animal matter (whole fish meal), (ii) it is marketed as being food for 'all cichlids', rather than a diet for herbivores, (iii) the protein content is listed as 40% minimum, but virtually all flakes are 40+% protein. What concerns a Tropheus keeper is the maximum % protein; the lower the better. So personally I would not feed this to my Tropheus as their main diet, although in a pinch (sorry) it might be OK. There are lots of spirulina flakes on the market; look for ones that have spirulina as one of their main ingredients.
 

fishguy1978

Legendary Member
Several things make me nervous about these flakes - (i) the first, and therefore most abundant, ingredient is animal matter (whole fish meal), (ii) it is marketed as being food for 'all cichlids', rather than a diet for herbivores, (iii) the protein content is listed as 40% minimum, but virtually all flakes are 40+% protein. What concerns a Tropheus keeper is the maximum % protein; the lower the better. So personally I would not feed this to my Tropheus as their main diet, although in a pinch (sorry) it might be OK. There are lots of spirulina flakes on the market; look for ones that have spirulina as one of their main ingredients.
I placed a food order to Ken’s for several staples and an herbivore flake.120F1102-1585-4B56-BD3B-7FD3E94B58C8.jpeg
 
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lloyd378

Administrator
Staff member
Contributing Member Level III
I love sir Keith’s tropheus tanks… can’t wait to check out yours, fishguy1978!

I once bought one single tropheus at a local petsmart ( they got one in accidentally) and it did not thrive under my care or being alone in a 75g…. This was about 15 years ago and way before I stumbled upon the fishbox.

I ended up giving it away to a local keeper near point defiance. I was always hopeful that i could have found more during that time, but the only place that carried them was up in Bellingham and I wasn’t willing to make that drive.

Excited to see some pics once they have settled in!
 
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